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X-Cal Shoot Interview by CMBurnham

Posted: Oct 20th 2005 By: oklastaff

CMBurnham: Thank you for coming here and doing this. The obvious place to start is at the beginning. Were
you a wrestling fan growing up?

X-Cal: Ever since I was 4 years old. I remember flipping through stations trying to find something good on TV on Saturday mornings and came across...I think it was Hulk Hogan giving--I don?t know who--a leg drop. Big yellow and red and big, tall muscular guy and I was hooked. Ever since then I?ve never been able to change the channel when it??s on.

and learned somethings about it, but never went to a show, so I totally missed everything you did there. I did ask Justin for some information about your time there to give me something to work off of. I understand you were part of the first Violence Alliance when you were there. Who else was in that with you?

XC: At the time it was just me & Chaz. I think it was just me and him for a while. Then I couldn?t come down as often as I could in the summer, so they branched off and had other members and when I came back I was a heel and they were faces. It was just me & Chaz.

CM: You were also a member of something called the HHC?

XC: Yeah.

CM: What was that?

XC: That was another little backyard fed from Haleyville, OK. And they would come up and do the Invasion angle and I was the turncoat and went with them. More or less another backyard fed.

CM: Was that when you were Inter-federation Champion?

XC: Yeah, that?s when I held that. I think it was more of a thing for Justin to create a title to shut me up because I used to say "I?m not the champ! Wahh! Wahh! Wahh!". My, how things don?t change...

CM: You were also a member of a group called the New Legacy.

XC: Yeah, that was Shane Morbid, Codie Mullins, Mitch Carter. The 4 of us were the New Legacy.

CM: There was a match that Justin put out on his DVD about ICF where he & Kenny had already been training with OPW and they came back and you, Mitch and Shane were in the ring. I think you were the one on the mic, calling them turncoats...

XC: Oh yeah. "You pro wrestlers! Turn your back on backyard wrestling! That was horrible..."

CM: I also understand that you fired a dozen times from ICF.

XC: Yeah. There?s this thing. People think that I?m very loose-lipped and I can?t keep my mouth shut whenever I need to sometimes. So me and Justin would constantly bicker and argue and he would "fire" me several times. I was young. I was young. It never changed really...

CM: When did you make the decision to start training? Was OPW still in existence?

XC: No, it was OCW. I&qcuted lived in Depew and once I?d graduated I immediately wanted to go into training. Of course, my funds were low because I didn?t even have a job when I graduated so I had to rally up some money. The Inter-federational belt was the OCW Light Heavyweight Title at one time and so (OCW owner) John Crow said that if I gave him that, it would take care of the deposit and the rest I could just pay off whenever I could. I think it was June, 2002 when I started the classes. Went to a couple of classes and ended up moving back and forth with a bunch of my friends trying to make it and I didn?t end up going back until December of that year.

CM: Who was responsible for most of your training?

XC: In the beginning, probably Kenny. And Justin did help out too. Kenny was probably my biggest influence through OCW and TLL or whatever...I don?t even want to bring up TLL...

CM: Oh, we?re going to.

XC: Kenny was probably the biggest influence as far as fundamentals goes.

CM: You made your debut at the beginning of 2003 and you had a series of matches with D-Day. What do you remember about those matches?

XC: I remember it was the beginning of January when Justin said "We?re gonna get you liscened up and ready to go. Don?t jump the gun. You?re not going in. You?ll never know when you?re going in. We?ll decide." So I got my license and I remember taking it out of the mailbox. I was so proud. It was sometime in the middle of February when I got the call from Justin. He said "Are you ready for the show tonight?" I was just working security and I said "Yeah." He said "Good. You&qacutere gonna work D-Day and you?re going over." I was like "Oh, really?" I was trying to play it cool, but the second I hung up the phone, I was probably doing cartwheels all over the living room. The match was OK. I remember showing up to the arena and D-Day, he?s so crazy. He said "C?mon, brother. It?s gonna be another day at the office for us. Another day at the office. This is our job." And I wasn?t even that nervous. I just wanted him to shut up because he was so annoying with that. I think we had--it was what it was for a series of matches.

CM: You had about 3 matchea and then OCW shut down. Were you concerned that you had just gotten started and then this was being pulled out from underneath you?

XC: I was a little concerned. At that time, I?d heard of SRPW, but I realised that they weren?t running consistently either. So I thought it better to just stay put and Sonny (C), Justin, Romero (Contreras), all them were friends of mine. And Rocco. So I just had faith that they would get something going because they told me "Don?t worry about it. We?re gonna get it taken care of." And they did, I guess.

CM: You were around when TPW started up and most of your time at the beginning you were tagging with Tyler Bateman. What do you remember about working with him?

XC: For some reason I can?t remember things too clearly. It might be the kicks to the head... I thought it was really cool because between Kenny and Tyler I was learning so much. And working with Rick (Styles). I loved working with Rick, I remember that. Everything else about TLL, the lucha libre stuff, when I look back, that was probably one of the shittier times of me being in the business, even though back then I was digging it because I was new and wanted to learn. Looking back that was probably one of the worst times I?ve ever had. But the matches with the Heatseekers and all that, that was cool.

CM: Any memories of working the Cinco de Mayo Festival?

XC: My first chance to work in front of a couple of thousand people, or whatever it was. I was really excited about it and I had just gotten comfortable with calling stuff in the ring. I wasn?t worried about people hearing me. At TLL, there was you and, like, 3 other people and they were probably family members of one of the boys. But here, I wasn?t worried. It was a big crowd and it was the first time I didn?t have to plan everything move-for-move in the back. I could go out, call stuff on the fly and better myself. It was fun. I think I worked El Sufamilico...

CM: Yeah. On May 3. You were his only successful title defence.

XC: That kid was 15 or 16. He?s Mexican, so I was worried, but he said "Hey, I can do the American way too." It was cool. I enjoyed it.

CM: You also had a couple of matches against Ron Mac.

XC: Yeah, he was very big and greener than I was when I went in there. I remember having to call...well, not realy call things, just remind him. I remember he stiffed me. Kicked me right in the lip and my lip bled. But thankfully I didn?t have to work much more with him. He fell off the face of the Earth.

XC: After TPW left Salon Azul, but while you were still with them, you won a Toughman contest. And TPW pushed that up pretty hard on your last shows. Could you tell us about winning that contest?

CM: Fluke. By definition. It had to be. I belive that if it were any other Toughman contest besides the Creek Nation one, I would have gotten my ass handed to me. I remember, probably 2 or 3 weeks before, I finally got it OK?d with Rocco (Valentino). He said "Sure. Cool. Do it." And I actually quit smoking cigarettes for those 3 weeks to get in boxing shape. Went and trained at Mikey?s gym because Sonny had a good hook-up there. Went and started training, got all ready for it and the day of it, Rocco told me, "Hey, go sit in the Jeep." I had the air-conditioner on and drank lots of water. So I had that advantage on because they were out in the heat and it was a hot-ass day. And they probably weren?t drinking water like they were supposed to. I remember the first fight, I went to the 2nd round and there were 3 seconds left and the guy, I think he couldn?t see. And then the second guy, he was a wildman, just swinging everywhere. I was kind of worried about him. I beat him in 40-some seconds in the first round because he couldn?t breathe. And then the last guy, I really lucked out, because he had just boxed and there was supposed to be another match after him, but one of the guys was in the ambulance. So he had to go again with me and he didn?t hardly get a break. I think that?s the only reason I won.

CM: You did your last match at the Indian Festival in June 2003. You had a tag match; you and Deuce Rodriguez against Anthony Jackson and Manservant. Had you made the decision that this was going to be the end with TPW or did that come later?

XC: I actually had one more match after that Indian Festival. It was a Triple Threat. Me, Kenny and Deuce at DJ?s.

CM: Oh, ok. I had forgotten you were there.

XC: I remember the tag match because Deuce was supposed to take the pinfall and I was supposed to look strong because I had won the Toughman contest the night before. Somehow it got all messed up. I guess Tony and them had taken about 30 minutes of the show just jibber-jabbering or whatever. So there towards the end. So there towards the end, I remember punching Manservant and he went down for the 10-count. Then after the 10, Ray
(Martinez) got the word from somebody to ring the bell and it was over. I remember Tony being really pissed off about that, but what can he do now? The next match I wrestled for them was me, Deuce and Kenny. I ended up going over by a punch on Deuce and that was setting up a title match between me and Kenny for the TPW Light Heavyweight Title and I never went back after that.

CM: Why not?

XC: Well, they had lost that place. I thought, "Well, there?s really no place else to work." And I started hearing from guys like Justin and Romero and Sonny that "It?s cool". They didn?t care. They weren?t concerned about getting anything quick and I wanted to wrestle. Then I talked to Dexter (Hardaway) and SRPW was having a show in Bristow, September 27 (2003). And I said "Hey, I live right down the road from Bristow. I grew up there. I wanna get on this show." Dexter called me and said "Alright. If you want on it, tell me now." I was gonna say, "Let me call Rocco", but decided "Fuck it". I told him I?d do it, then I called Rocco. I said, "Look, I agreed to the show. You guys aren?t running. Is that OK?" He said "You know what, we?ve been through this before. Blah-blah-blah. I?m a legend. I created the sun, the moon and the earth". He said he wouldn?t have me back and he didn?t think the boys would want me back either. Here are his words: "You need to remember who you hang out with come barbecue time." So I thought, "I don?t know what that means, Rocco. I?m gonna go ahead and work it." I worked it. They let me win the Tag Titles with Tarantula--or Sir Smokes-a-Lot--whatever you want to call him. I didn?t have a problem with anybody. I didn?t say "Fuck these guys in TPW. I"m going to SRPW." It was more like I needed to work. I wanted to work. I still had that fire and TPW didn?t seem like they had that where they wanted to work and I did, so I went where there was work.

CM: Were you surprised when you went to SRPW and they gave you a title immediately upon walking in? And were you happy with that match? What do you remember about that match?

XC: It was a TLC match. I remember I was excited about that match because a lot of my family got to go to that and some of my friends from high school. I was excited because that was the first time they got to see me like that, my brother and them. So I was excited. I think the match went OK. I can look back at it and it?s not one of my best, but it was fun. I had a good time. I wasn?t really surprised that they gave me the Tag Team Titles because of a lack of choice. I mean, KC and JC weren?t really dependable as far as coming down all the time and (SRPW) probably didn?t want to pay them what they thought they should be paid. So I wasn?t shocked, but I thought it was kind of cool. Because Rocco was telling me, "I?m trying to build you up like a star over here and you?re just going to go over there and put one of their guys over.", but I end up winning one of their belts.

CM: But you never got to defend that title. At least not with Tarantula. What was the deal with that?

XC: I don?t know, I think T might have been doing his second tour of AAA in Mexico. Or it could be Thailand. I heard he wrestled there. Or Germany. He could have been on tour. I don?t know what happened. I know he just dropped off the face of the Earth. Him & Ron Mac were sitting down there playing cards or something.

CM: Any memories of the handicap match where you lost the titles to Northern Threat?

XC: Hung over. Hung over. Jesus Christ, I was hung over. I don?t even know how to talk about the handicap match because it was pretty much me getting my ass whipped for the 8 minutes or whatever it was. It was no big deal. I didn?t expect them to put me over. I knew better than that. Wasn?t a classic, but it was fun, I guess. I was hung over, though.

CM: On November 22, you had what I think is your only match against Brent Albright. Any memories of working with him?

XC: He has a really stiff clothesline. And I??m saying "Stiff"?, but to him that?s probably "working tight". I thought it was cool because I think he got signed (to the WWE) just before that. So I thought, "Yay! I?m working with a guy who got signed." Plus he?d been working out with me in the ring for a month or 2 before that. Or whenever we got Mickey?s. I thought it was cool. I?d always wanted to work a guy like that, I?m just not really the size to do so. Especially to get offence on him. But I remember he was doing the Light Heavyweight gimmick where he was going to start at the bottom and work his way up to the top and I was the first guy he let do a couple of things to. I got him in a hammerlock and I got a nearfall on him. Actually did a split-legged moonsault on him. I thought that was cool. He didn?t have to do that because all the other people before that he?d sqashed, he?d done just that: squashed them. I thought it was a nice gesture on his part.

CM: On Dec 13, you won a gauntlet match to become the first SRPW Light Heavyweight Champion. Any memories of that?

XC: El Guapo Loco?s dance moves really stand out. I remember that. And Brent?s idea for that match was to have me start and go through every single person. And that kind of got nixed. He thought "Well, what better way to make the first every champion look strong?" I forget who I went through. I think it was Dexter...

CM: Anarchy was the last one. Dexter was next to last.

XC: Yeah. I took El Guapo Loco out. Took Dexter out, then Anarchy. Still don?t know who that guy is. Maybe I?ll ask Kenny... I thought that was a fun night because some of my family did get to go to that. Friends that went off to college came down and we all partied afterwards because there?s nothing like drinking beer with a Light Heavyweight Title around your waist.

CM: The next year at the Indoor Fun Fair they ran a programme where you and Dexter were trying to reform Generation X to take on the Fraternity of Sin. What do you remember about that series?

XC: Oh God, I was marking out. Because when I used to go to the OPW shows, Gen X--Ian St. James and Zane Morris or Zane D?Maestro, whatever the hell he was going by--I was a big mark for them. I thought it was cool and then Ian was coming in every now and then. And he brought down one of his jerseys and I was like "Can I wear that?" He got one of his old ones and he gave it to me. We covered out where it said "Ian" and put a little tape of "X" on there. I thought it was really fun. At that time, that was the funnest time I had in SRPW. The Fun Fair shows that year were really cool. I liked them.

CM: Had you started going down to ACW at that point or was that later?

XC: Yeah, I had.

CM: How did you get connected with them?

XC: I was still in TPW when I first started going down there. I believe it was Tyler that hooked Kenny up, then Kenny hooked me up. I ended up going down there and being Jef Tiger?s little cronie. First time I went down there, (Brandon) Bishop had nothing for me, so Jef said "Here. Here?s a tip jar. Go see if you can get people to give tips for Lil Joe?s retirement fund." I went around and did that. I think Jef made $3 off of that. I got a bunch of other shit thrown on me.

CM: Was that where the "Loose Cannon" first started, down there?

XC: No, that actually started in SRPW. I was X-Cal down there. I never went by "The Loose Cannon"...

CM: I talked to Bishop and he said that you started as Jef Tigera?s bitch. Then you evolved from that into an "out of control heel". So when I read "out of control heel", I think of the "Loose Cannon" character.

XC: Oh, out of control, God. When there?s no boxing commission to breathe down you neck, and me being so new at the time, not used to having no boundaries, I sort of took advantage of that. So we?d tie up. Headlock, wristlock, whatever. Then I?m screaming "FUCK YOU! FUCK YOU! FUCK YOU!" just because I can, and it pissed everybody off. That?s what it was. I was very vocal and I think that?s one of the best things, as far as me coming out of my shell, was going to ACW.

CM: Did you form X2C down there with Cade (Sydal)?

XC: I think the original idea was for me to run the X2C thing with Cade and then he was going to turn on me and
go to the Fraternity, but it never ended up like that. There was talk about it, but it was formed down there. In
ACW, we officially became X2C.

CM: You guys won the ACW Tag Team Titles off of Lil Joe in a handicap match and then lost them back to Ty
Magnus and Lil Joe a couple of weeks later. Any memories of those matches?

XC: I don?t remember the first one that good. I don?t know why. But I remember dropping the belts. Me & Cade, before we went out the curtain, we both had a shot of Crown Royale. I don?t know why. I guess we were
both just "Cheersz"-ing to dropping our titles or whatever. And I think at the time, we were talking about not coming down there anymore. We thought it was going to be the last time, so we had our "Cheers" before we went out, then went out and dropped the belts.

CM: You also took the Cruiserweight Title off of Lil Joe and dropped it to Kenny.

XC: I have no memory of dropping it to Kenny, but I?m sure I did. I don?t even remember getting it off of Joe. The thing about ACW--you can ask anyone--I was involved in 6 or 7 segments a show, if not 3 or 4 matches a night. Then at the end of the night, I get my big-ass payoff of 5 fucking dollars! That stopped after a while, but I?ll tell you the first 4 times I went down there, it was $5. And if it weren?t for guys like Kenny and Tyler, my ass would have starved the whole trip down there, but they took care of me. I?ll always thank them for that.

CM: I?ve just got to read this next thing the way Bishop sent it to me because I can?t believe it. It sounds so funny. "You stole the Hardcore title from Big John O?Malley and you tried to present it to Jef Tigar. Tigar had to piss first. He told you to stay there, lie on your back, sing the "Three?s Company" theme until he got done. Kenny walks in and quietly pins you for the Hardcore title outside the bathroom."

XC: I remember that was the hardest vignette to shoot because it was so hard not to laugh. You can even see the
footage and I bust up a little. It was really hard,. but it was really funny. That was probably the best vignette I ever did down there. I was involved in some of the funny ones.

CM: What about working with Bernie Donderwitz as part of the Jury of Ethnic Wonders (J.E.W.)?

XC: I love working Bernie. Any time I get to work him I know we?re gonna have a good match...if I?m not all greased up in baby oil like the last time. We always had fun. I think we did. If you ask him I hope he?d say we did. He was a really fun person to work. Hea?s very aware in the ring. He calls his stuff very well. He?s just a good person to work. I liked him.

CM: You are the only person down there to hold all 4 championships because you won the Heavyweight Title in a
battle royale. What do you remember about that particular match?

XC: I remember hearing they were going to put it on me and thinking "Ahh, man. That?s cool". And then I stopped and thought, "What the fuck are they thinking? I?m 150-someodd pounds." And I didn?t catch heat from a lot of the other boys, but they kind of came up and told me how they felt about it. They said "It?s kind of bullshit. You know that, right?" I said, "Yeah." They weren?t unprofessional with me in the ring. I think the last 2 were Bernie and Chris Matthews. And I just remember them suplexing me about 40 times apiece. And that?s almost not an exaggeration. But then I eliminated Bernie...well, actually Chris Matthews did. I ducked out of the way and he eliminated Bernie. John O?Malley was out taunting Chris Matthews at ringside and while his back was turned, I gave him a dropkick over the ropes and I won the Heavyweight Title.

CM: But you never actually defended it?

XC: No.

CM: Why didn?t you go back down there to do that?

XC: I thought that?s what people did. You win the titles and then leave the company.

CM: Ahh. You?re following Kenny?s example.

XC: Yeah, see, I told you he trianed me in a lot of ways. I think it was a matter of I had started a new job and I really couldn?t afford to go down there anymore, not for what he was paying me. I knew he could pay me more than what he was, but I didn?t feel like going through the arguement. I just said, "To Hell with it." In retrospect I probably should have found some way to get down there to at least drop it, but I never did.

CM: You were also involved in the early days of NWA-OK. What were your impressions when you met Chris
Fox? How did you get connected with him?

XC: I thought he was a good guy at first. I went to the first show in Ponca City and I met the booker and then I
met Chris...I don?t think I met him that night. I might have. But they held an open tryout the next day in Perry. I went there and I worked a tryout match with Cade and I guess it went well enough. So they put us in the Gauntlet match at the end for the X Division Title. Oh God. I remember it was gonna be...the people before me, it was Brandon Bishop and Scotty Charisma. Scotty had come up to me, because Dexter said "I want X-Cal in the finals." So the booker said, "OK. You want him, you got him." So Scotty comes up to me and says, "Well, I gotta find a way for me and Bishop to eliminate ourselves because there?s nothing you could do to me that would be believable." I thought, "Oh. He?s one of these fucking assholes.? I hope you put that on record. Scotty Charisma can go fuck himself as far as I?m concerned. He?s a cocksucker and I don?t like him. He?s got a 190 pound frame. He?s not the biggest guy in the world and he?s telling me that I can?t do anything believable to him. And he was talking move-wise, too. I thought, "Jesus Christ, I&cuteve wrestled Chris Matthews and he?s put me over in certain ways. And Brent Albright. And this fucking guy who?s an inch taller than me is talking all this shit? Whatever." But the finals...me and Dexter. Shooting Star Press. I lost. That?s pretty much the memory. And Chris Fox, he?s never done anything wrong to me. Don?t get me wrong. If I wanted to, I could say that he?s a dumbass. And he was. But he?s never done anything wrong to me, so I won?t say anything more than he?s kind of a dipshit.

CM: You were involved in a tag match in May, 2004 in Bristow with Shark Boy against Dexter and Bishop. You
weren?t advertised originally for that match, they advertised Doink the Clown. How did you get put into that slot?

XC: I think Doink actually got into a....well, I don?t know. I?m not gonna say it because I don?t know if this guy wants his business strung out like that. Let?s just say that he had a matter where he couldn?t make it and I was there, basically. The booker told me, I think it was after the first match or maybe not even that far in, he said,
"Well, you might as well get dressed.." I thought, "OK, cool." It was fun. I would rather have been on the opposite end, rather than teaming (with Shark Boy.) That way I could work with him. But that was fun. I remember the funniest part was when Shark and Bishop finally got in there. There was the lockup and this awkward-ass hiptoss from Bishop. Shark?s pissed off. He slaps the mat real hard and says, "Dammit." Then another tie-up and almost a shoot armdrag from Bishop to Shark and it made Shark land all high on his shoulder. It made Shark all pissed off and he gets up and walks up to me. I was standing on the apron and he says, "Was this guy fucking trained?" I think I said, "Poorly" or something like that. I was trying not to laugh. I think that was the funniest part of the match. And the fact that Bishop fucked up 2 other things of his. If you look at the
tape, you can see Sharkacutes face through the mask just saying, "What the fuck?"

CM: You worked one more show for them. You worked Dexter for the Oklahoma X Division Title and at this
point, there was another one of these resurgances, which seems so prevelant in Oklahoma wrestling, where they
say, "If you work for HERE, you can?t work for THERE." If you had chosen to stay and commit yourself to NWA-OK, do you think you would have won the X Division Title that night? Were you given any hint on that?

XC: No, I didn?t even tell him what I intended to do. I don?t think he ever even intended to put it on me, really. I think he wanted to have Dexter work Jerelle Clark or something. I don?t think he ever really wanted to put it on me.

CM: You dropped the SRPW Light Heavyweight Title to Cade in a Teen Idol Death Match. What do you remember about that?

XC: What the hell is a Teen Idol Death Match? Jesus. (SRPW photographer) Steveco said that was a really well
played angle between me and Cade. I just didn?t see it because we had been playing this angle out since February, if not before. And we were having to carry this story from the west side of Tulsa to Sapulpa to Ponca City to the Fair. The match itself didn?t mean much to me. That was my last there for.....I think I missed a show. I was on one of my big hiatus kicks, which seems to be regular in the time of May. I really wasn?t that fond of the match that much. It was what it was.

CM: Was it your idea to turn heel and join the Fraternity of Sin or was that given to you?

XC: I think it was Luc (Lapointe). I remember telling them that I would like to try to work heel, but I think the whole Going to the Fraternity thing was Luc and Cade who were trying to pull that off, so I said, "O---K. I??ll join ANOTHER faction."

CM: Yeah, you seem to have been involved in a large amount of groups.

XC: To quote Steveco, I?m "the fucking X-Pac of this company." Or whatever. I guess the company?s going under now...

CM: After you joined the Fraternity, you started the programme that I think most people will remember you for in SRPW. Your feud with Timmy J. What are your memories of your matches with Tim?

XC: Oh man, it was fun. I remember our first match was probably in August and I think I had just gotten back
from a Ricky Steamboat clinic. I was on a high horse at the time. That really gave me a boost that I needed. And
I remember coming back down, I thought, "I?d like to work someone green." I mean, I?m still green, even to this day, but I wanted somebody green, somebody new, somebody fresh, somebody that I won?t have to actually lead around too much. So I thought, "Timmy. I want to wrestle Timmy." I kept pushing for that. We got one of our matches and it ended up pretty good and I think Teddy Long was there that night and he said, "That was really good." I ended up hurting my knee because of that little bastard. He threw me off on a Tornado DDT and I ended up tweaking my knee a bit. Teddy Long said, "Well, that was good. At least you went through with the match and
you didn?t stop." It was fun. And working him through that whole angle, and at the end I was actually living with him for a while, I thought it went great. It didn?t get done the way we wanted it, but that was probably the closest we were going to get to it. It was fun, though, and the fans were into it. "The Loose Cannon Chris Gazaway is evil. X-Cal?s the happy go-lucky guy." I think our blowoff match went really well because people started chanting "X-Cal." That was great.

CM: Any memories of the Wagoner Fall Festival from last year?

XC: They took my jacket, man. My jacket. Beau Dalton gave me that jacket. My black leather jacket
with flames down the sleeves. They took it. I remember it was very fun. I was hanging out a
lot at the time with Adam Thornstowe. That guy was crazy. He was a blast. I remember the last show of the last event of Wagoner, we all got drunk. I wasn?t scheduled to be on the show and neither was Jack Legacy or
Adam...I think Adam might have been, but he wasn?t drinking, I don?t think. Me and Jack were sitting there and we downed a bottle of Southern Comfort and then (the staff) walks up and say, "You guys, you gotta go on. We gotta have a 6-man." I remember there were a lot of people in that match. We did that, I was drunk off my ass. I didn?t throw too many things. Maybe Mitch (Carter) around a couple of times.

CM: 2005 starts off with a high profile match, the ladder match for the SRPW Light Heavyweight Title. Any
memories of that match?

XC: I was...God, how do you say it? I wasn?t scared. I wasn?t nervous. I was probably more ready to just get on with the match rather than have that build up before. Because I remember walking in and going over a couple of things and then I just went to the back and kept to myself. I had this weird feeling like I just wanted to get it over with or something. But it was really fun and watching the DVD, I think it turned out OK. Mitch?s DVD. I STOLE YOUR DVD, MITCH!! Yeah, I got the Mitch Carter DVD and it has that match on it. It turned out not too bad.

CM: After you had your "respect*quot match with Timmy, you and Timmy and Cade form the 918 Boyz and the
SRPW Tag Team Title tournament began. A lot of people who knew your history and knew you were regular tag
team partners expected you and Cade to go in as the tag team entry for the team or to do something like the old
Freebirds rule, where any 2 of the 3 of you could go in and tag. Why weren?t you involved with that?

XC: The truth is that it was May and I went on another hiatus and I really didn?t think that I was going to come back ever. I guess...I never wanted to be part of the 918 Boyz. I never wanted to be part of a tag team. I?m a singles guy. I guess I?m just in it for myself, I guess, to have a good match for tapes to send off somewhere. I don?t know. I just didn?t want to be part of the 918 Boyz. And that?s not why I left,. I guess it was the girlfriend. I had a girlfriend and I was gettting pretty serious with her and...Oh, Jesus Christ. I really felt burnt out at the time. Adam left and went back home and he was really the one who brought life back into me. Him and Tim both. Made me want to try and be successful. Adam left and I was actually supposed to leave with him and I didn?t. I
had the girlfriend. The old ball and chain. I was just so burnt out at that point I just had to get away. I didn?t even know if I was going to come back.

CM: Sometime around that, you did the knee injury angle with Paul Linam, which, at the time we?re speaking,
would be your last feud in SRPW. Were you wanting to make that any longer than it was? Were you trying to do
with him what you did with Timmy?

XC: I knew I was leaving, back in May. At the time, there was nothing for me. I said, "Look, I?m leaving. I?m gone. I?m not coming back." And I think Tim had a lot of influence in booking at the time. So I talked to him and said, "Look, have one of the green guys go over on me. Paul. Have Paul do it." And he was like, "Alright. Cool. Whatever." He was actually pissed off. He didn?t want me to leave. So I get Paul and then I hear from Tim. "We?re gonna have Paul take out your knee because I know you?re coming back." I said, "I??m not fucking coming back." He said, "We?re gonna leave that window open for you because I know you?re coming back." I
said, "Fuck you, Tim. I?m not coming back." Well, fuck you, Tim, for being right. Because I did. I came back. He had me gimmick the knee out and that explained my absence. And I had a great time while I wasn?t wrestling. I cleared my head and I really think I needed that break because I was ready to walk away from it all. Women...

CM: You got some criticism, maybe not so public, but I?ve heard some criticism about the last match, the
lumberjack match you had with Paul. Because you went over on him and you were on your way out of the
company. Any response to that?

XC: Not public criticism? What do you mean by that?

CM: I have my sources...

XC: Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, here?s the thing. For me to request Paul, that was a favour to him. And going through the whole thing, I had no idea going into the first match with him how green he was. Because people were telling me, "Oh, he ?s getting better, he?s getting better. No offense to Paul, he?s got fire, he?s got heart, but the dude probably should have had 5 more months of training without stepping into the ring during a show. So I thought this guy?s really horrible, in a nice way. I don?t know if I want to go out like that. Not on my back. And at the time I really didn?t know if I was going to leave or not. I think the last straw was Sarah (Harmon, SRPW Owner) a match or two before mine, she came in the back bitching about something yet again.
And looking back, I probably should have told Paul to move out of the way on the Shooting Star and then roll me
up or do something. I got a lot of shit, but really, you can?t spring something like that on someone that green.
I?m not trying to justify myself here, but basically, I didn?t want to put him over. I wanted to go out on top. And now it really doesn?t matter.

CM: You went down for a couple of matches in IZW. You worked the 4-Way match against Tyler, Kenny and Dexter for the Impact Division Title. Any memories of that? This would have been in May...

XC: Oh, shit, yeah. I did work that. It was rumoured that Tyler works pretty tight himself. I found that out. He?s really stiff. He made me see stars and shit. I think I got to work a lot that match with Tyler. It?s always fun to work Tyler. Other than that, I really don?t have a lot to say about it.

CM: And just last week, you worked the first CWE show as the Amazing Blue. You weren?t advertised on the
show, until about 2 days before the show when I got a press release advertising you even though they never actually changed it on their site. Did you get connected on that through Shark Boy?

XC: No, it was actually through Brandon Groom. And through Tim, because they guy couldn?t get ahold of me, so he called Tim. Tim got to work Matt Morgan and said, "Well, I got a friend." The guy said, "Well, I only needed 2 and I got the other guy." Then he called me and said, "Sorry man. Well, you could at least bring your gear and see." I said, "OK." Then Tim calls me back the next day and says, "Hey man. (Amazing) Red might not show up. So bring your gear defintely and you might be in that 3-way." I thought, "OK." Then he calls me the
next day and says, "Look, it?s definite. Red?s not showing up. You?re gonna be in the match against Shark Boy and Delerious. But do you have a problem being the Amazing Blue?" I said, "Are you fucking kidding me? Do you want me to be the Amazing Blue or do (the CWE owners) want me to be the Amazing Blue? Well, sure. I?ll just have to have a talk with the guy and see what?s going on with this." So whenever I get there, I ask him, "Hey.
I work in Tulsa quite a bit. People know me as X-Cal." He said, "I know, I know. But what I want to do is build this match up between the Amazing Red versus the Amazing Blue. So you?re just going to be the Amazing Blue tonight?? I said, "Well, what does Red think about this?" He said, "I already talked to Red about it and he thinks it?s fine, it?s OK." I thought, "Well, alright then." And I talked to Jerry Lynn later that night at the hotel bar. I was telling him and Shark both, "The last thing I want to be remembered as is the Amazing Fucking Blue." Jerry started laughing and said, "Well, you?re fucked now."

CM: Who was the brains behind that show?

XC: I think his name was Brad. I don?t remember what his last name was. This was the first show I?d ever been at where there were so many agents. Dr. Tom (Prichard) was back there. Jerry and Dr. Tom were watching the video with their headsets behind the curtains. And this was the first time that I had all these cameras that I had to remember were there. So it was a good taste of what things are like at the next level.

CM: Somewhere along the line you adopted this unofficial nickname. You became known as the "Genrizzal".
How did that come about? What?s that all about?

XC: We used to have a clique called the Shooter?s Club. It was...I don?t know. There were so may members of that thing. I know Cade was the treasurer of the Shooter?s Club. I think I kind of gave the nickname to myself because I was being a smart-ass and telling all these hokey stories like, "Have you heard about the time me and Ed Leslie got into a fist fight behind a bar back in ?82"? Shit like that. So I think I jokingly said it one day in Kenny?s direction. I said, "Fuck you, I?m the General", as in the ring general. We just kind of rolled with it. I?ve
been the Genrizzal ever since.

CM: I?m gonna do a little name association with you, mostly people that we haven?t had a chance to talk about, but that you had matches again or associations with and you just tell me any memories, thoughts, feelings about them that you want to. Let?s start with Anthony Jackson.

XC: I know I had a 6-man with him once. Anthony Jackson, he?s a nice guy to your face, he?ll say one thing, but after that, I don?t know. I don?t really have anything to say about him.

CM: Sudden Impact.

XC: Very quiet. Less is more with Sudden Impact.

CM: Shane Morbid

XC: Shane Morbid. I?ve been back and forth with him. Here lately, I?ve been cool with him. I think he?s a good guy deep down. At first, he was kind of a whiny bitch, but now he seems pretty cool.

CM: Poo Bear

XC: Poo Bear. How you gonna hate on Poo Bear? That kid said he was gonna be a pro wrestler and he did it, so
you can?t hate on him for that.

CM: Sonny C.

XC: Sonny C. See, this guy, me and him go way back. I dunno. Me and Sonny, we?ve kept a good relationship. When I first went and started out, it was like big brother-little brother. That kind of dwindled down whenever I went my way and he stayed whereever he was. I think now that he finally realised that Rocco?s full of his own shit, now me and Sonny are a lot closer than we have been. So Sonny?s a cool guy.

CM: Romero Contreras

XC: That guy, he was cool at first, but he?s one of those guys who would rather have his head up Rocco?s ass then think for himself. I don?t like him. I think he?s an arrogant little prick who knows jackshit about the wrestling business.

CM: Dexter Hardaway

XC: Dexter That dude is not a very bad guy, dude. Dexter went off to Louisville. Apparently, he?s trying to give it his all. I love Dexter to death. When I went to SRPW, he?s very responsible for my work rate. Kenny had the fundamentals. Dexter just showed me how to use them.

CM: Justin Lee

XC: He?s kinda...or he has been, or was...I don?t know now because I don?t talk to him as much and we?re kind of on talking terms now. I?ve talked to him a few times...He?s kind of like Romero there towards the end of my stint in TPW. He was too busy trying to be the number one guy, Rocco?s right hand man, rather than just be himself and be real. I don?t know. Justin...I want to like the guy, but sometimes I can?t.

CM: Dirty Harry Sanchez

XC: This guy and I, we?ve been through a lot. I love him to death. He?s my brother. He?s my twin brother from another mother.

CM: Mike Iles

XC: Mike Iles, he?s a good guy. I like him. I thought he was kind of naive to think that Chris Fox was going to take him places that SRPW couldn?t, because he probably got to be in the presence of a few big names, but that?s probably all he got out of NWA-OK. Any person who gets in the business is gonna believe anything, especially when there?s big names on the card. Mike?s a good guy. I still like him.

CM: Mitch Carter

XC: We broke in at the same time and I remember him leaving for whatever reasons it was and bagging on
wrestling, talking about how stupid it was and how I was a dumbass for travelling and wasting all my money on
shit like this and how wrestling was just a hobby to him. He used to criticise me for travelling and shit and then when he came to SRPW, he still had that kind of stand-offish feel about him. And then finally all the things he was criticising me for, he?s doing now. Except he didn?t get booked on the CWE show like I did. He didn?t get to work Shark Boy and Delerious. He did get to work the Naturals. Ask him, hea?ll tell you...

CM: Yeah. I was there. The New Texas Outlaws.

XC: That consisted of Bobby Burns, Bernard Funk and Renegade, right? I like all those guys. Bobby, he?s loud, he?s obnoxious at times, but he?s got a good heart. He?s a really nice guy. I like him. Same with Renegade. I grew up watching Renegade so I thought it was cool to hang out with him. Bernie, I like him. He?s a good guy.
(Flamon) Raymon? I don?t know. I?ve always kind of had my eye on Raymon. He?s cool too. I get along with all of them.

CM: Beau Dalton

XC: I love Beau Dalton. He?s really cool. He gave me that jacket, by the way, that got stolen in Wagoner.

CM: John O?Malley

XC: Big John. He?s cool, but a thing that people don?t know is that John is a really weak person. One time I was down in ACW and he went to lift me up for a bodyslam and he couldn?t lift me up. Granted I had the heavy leg going at the time... John, I love him to death, but he?s a weak son of a bitch.

CM: Gary Tool.

XC: I think I?m very fortunate to have met Gary Tool. Gary?s one of those guys that, if he says, "I?m gonna bring you down for a show and give you $1000", you?re gonna get $1000. You?re not gonna have to follow him around the whole arena and have him say, "Wait a minute...". Gary?s true to his word. Gary?s a class act and a one of a
kind for promoters around this state, at least.

CM: Chris Matthews

XC: He?s a good guy. He?s always gone out of his way to try and help me, whatever I needed help with, be it real life situations or wrestling. I can?t say enough about him.

CM: Ray Martinez

XC: I hate that son of a bitch!! No, I love Ray. He?s a cool guy. His wife makes really good sandwiches. I think I had 1 or 2...no, I had THREE over there at his house one time. I love Ray.

CM: Lily McKenzie

XC: Lily McKenzie and I, we used to like this (crosses fingers). We were tight, we were cool. She?s turned into something of a know-it-all bitch as of late. But it happens. It happens.

CM: Luc Lapointe

XC: I?ll say he looks better now that he?s diabetic. He?s in a helluva good shape. I love Luc to death. He?s a good guy.

CM: And Sarah Harmon

XC: If you would have asked me about 2 months ago, I would have had nothing but good things to say about
Sarah. And I still do. I think she?s a good lady and all that, but when it comes to in ring work and wrestling, shut the fuck up because you don?t know anything about it. That?s the reason I left because she bitched and bitched and she thought she knew what was right and what was wrong. For some reason, bad guys shouldn?t win. Ever. I don?t know...

CM: When you were still with ICF, Channel 8 did a segment on backyard wrestling...

XC: Damn, you saw that?

CM: I have it on DVD. Thank you, Justin. You got to speak more than anyone including Justin and Kenny who
were already in the training school for OPW at the time. What were your impressions of doing that?

XC: I think I said so much and I said some things that they could use to make me look bad. "We don?t use trash cans or anthing like that to bash each other in the head" "Well, they might not use that, but they use this" Showing all these other fucking weapons and shit. I think I was the most talkative and not as nervous. I think Cody Maverick and Poo Bear were the only other ones there. I think I was just the least
nervous of the backyard kids. And I think I tried to say, "I know this isn?t safe. Blah blah blah" and they probably used that because they could use that against me to make me look bad. But I knew what I was there for. I knew it was to promote the OPW school. I was just trying to word my stuff very carefully to not get used against me. The
world of media kicked me right in the ass.

CM: Was there anybody you worked with in ICF that you thought were going to go on, just like Mitch or Poo, but
they never did?

XC: That Chaz guy. I thought if he tried, he might be on the indy scene and be good. Another guy was Criminal
X. Very athletic and he was in very good shape. I heard he?s a junkie now... Chaz and Criminal X, those are
about the only ones.

CM: What?s in store for you now? You?ve quit SRPW and I think the feelings between you and TPW are still bitter. What is in your future as far as wrestling is concerned, if anything?

XC: I have IZW to look forward to. Oh, but I did say all those horrible things about Gary Tool when
you turned the recorder off. Fuck, if he ever finds out... No, IZW. The CWE is supposed to coming back in
December. Hopefully I can get that match with Red. Maybe Terry Taylor will see it and say, "Hey. Come down to NWA-TNA for something." I think right now, my plan is---and I?m gonna be totally honest---I?m gonna get juiced up, get some nice tights, look pretty, fit the part, and start sending tapes and travelling and stop worrying about the political bullshit that?s a part of Tulsa or Oklahoma as a state. Just start to try and market myself better and try to get out of here.

CM: Have you given any thought to working for the new CSWA?

XC: I really haven?t heard much about it, because it?s all so kayfabish. But I?ll work whereever they?ll pay me. Sometimes I won?t even ask for that.

CM: Is there anything you?d like to say to your fans who have supported you throughout your career?

XC: Fuck all you guys! If you really want to know what I think, you can all kiss my ass, because everytime I?m out there, if I?m working a wristlock or a headlock, you ain?t got shit to say. I risk life and limb and when I go up for that Shooting Star Press, now you want to clap your hands? Fuck you guys! You can all kiss my ass and burn in Hell. No, really, thank you for supporting me. Sonsabitches...