• Look Back In History
• Pmessages
• Quiz
• Stump The Staff
• Top Fifty
• Close

Missy's Manor: Great Debate '08 DVD Review

Posted: Nov 17th 2008 By: CMBurnham

Recently the great people at www.kayfabecommentaries.com sent me 'The Great Debate '08' between Bruno Sammartino & Harley Race. The DVD takes the two top champions of the 1970's for the NWA & the WWWF and allows them to discuss which territory was more superior. The criteria to determine who had the better territory ranges from who had the best heels, baby faces, promoters, storylines, gates, and more. The DVD sounded so enticing that I had to annoy Sean Oliver and co. to send me the DVD.

My only argument would be comparing the NWA to the WWWF. Technically the NWA was several territories under a governing body that recognized their affiliation with each other and acknowledged the same champion. To lump all the territories in to one entity against the WWWF can be misleading at times. Regardless, both wrestlers are highly respected and there is enough topics to keep me interested in this DVD,

Before I start giving my synopsis on the DVD, I want to give my background as a fan of the time period that is being discussed. I grew up on Georgia Championship Wrestling in the early 80's. At that time period, Tommy Rich was the hottest baby face, Ric Flair was in his first title reign, Freebirds were the greatest heels, and Harley Race was about to regain the NWA title. I was not familiar with the WWWF product at all. It was only recently that I seen old WWWF/WWF MSG matches from the 1970's-early 80's. Needless to say, I'm not the most knowledgeable person to be disputing most points by both wrestlers. Luckily there is enough content to educate old school and current wrestling fans.

What Is More Superior: The Touring NWA Champion VS. Defending WWWF Champion:
I thought Bruno made a excellent point that it is much harder staying on top as a regular main eventer in the same territory. Bruno even pointed out how difficult it was for Buddy Rogers to be a regular heel champion in the same territory. A baby face champion can draw off of their fan base to draw in the same territory on a regular basis. This is contrast to the NWA champion who usually comes in to a territory for one night stands.

I think Bruno made a excellent point that the champion should be able to adapt to different opponents and styles. It keeps the champion from getting stale and repetitive. Bruno pointed out how Ric Flair would have the same match nightly, but yet be regarded as the greatest. Bruno was pretty adamant that Flair kept having the same match, but he respected how hard of a worker he was.

Unfortunately Harley didn't make a great defense in defending Flair's style. Race was very vague and neutral in his answer. Race did rank himself highly [nobody will dispute that point], but refuses to rank the greatest.

Who Was A Great Heel:
Race discusses how a great heel can lead a match. Bruno mentioned how Ray Stevens was a great heel, due to his bump taking style. Sammartino than contrasted how Killer Kowalski could brawl and wrestle, which made him a great draw. By wrestling different heels with different styles, this would keep Bruno fresh in drawing monthly crowds. This was due to him not having the same match against different opponents.

Who Was A Great Baby Face:
Bruno mentioned how his matches could range from brawling against Bruiser Brody to being technical against Pedro Morales. Bruno felt a baby face needs to make their matches different in order to keep drawing.

Harley Race ranked Pat O'Connor, Jack Brisco, and Verne Gagne as great technical baby faces. But Race was indecisive on picking a great baby face. He felt a effective baby face had to be able to know how draw sympathy from the crowd by the way they sell.

Harder To Be a Heel Or Baby Face:
Race felt it is harder to be baby face. Race admits it would be difficult for him to wrestle a baby face style. A baby face has to be sincere and connect with the fans 24/7. Race mentioned how as a heel, he was stabbed and burnt. He felt it's easier to be a heel, since they lead the match.

Bruno agreed that a baby face style is harder. Since a heel can get heat by cheating. A baby face is harder, since they have to find the right median in selling and not over selling.

Best Geographical Area:
Bruno made a great point about how the North East got the best arenas. This gives a wrestling promotion the perception of being the big league. He mentioned by being in NY, that it got him multiple magazine coverage and exposure on the MSG network. This allowed Bruno to be recognized immediately in outside territories. Bruno also mentioned how he had the ethnic factor in being a major draw with Italian-Americans in the North East. I thought Bruno made a great point when he said it didn't matter where Race worked, since he was talented enough to be a star anywhere.

I thought it was interesting how Bruno would recommend talent that he saw from different territories to Vince McMahon, Sr. They would than be booked based on Bruno's opinion on talent by Vince. This is a big deal when you compare it to many locker rooms. Bruno recognized if he can draw against a person that he recommended, than everybody in the territory benefits. This is in contrast to some locker rooms that have stars that are so protective of their spots. This causes a lack of new stars from being elevated.

Race made the comparison of how Sam Muchnick ran St. Louis similar to NY. Both groups ran monthly and had to alternate talent in order to keep drawing.

What Makes a Great Booker:
Race mentions that imagination is very important. New stars need to be developed. Bruno said a eye for talent and television exposure makes stars. Very simple thinking by both wrestlers. One has to question why this concept is going over the heads of some writers.

Bruno mentions the dangers of having all competitive matches than squash matches on television. He feels if they see competitive matches on TV, it than makes it harder to draw fans to see the live shows. Squash matches make the stars appear bigger and you have to see the stars at the arena have competitive matches. Bruno's view is that fans have now been accustomed to seeing non squash television, this causes squash matches to be obsolete. I totally agree that television should be making more of a effort to entice people to buy house show tickets.

Race mentions how the business needs to maintain the mystique of wrestling as being real. Bruno than relates how effective heels like Bill Watts, Larry Zbyszko, and Spiros Aryon had so much heat that they enraged the fans in trying to attack them. Bruno than contrasts how absurd angles like Hulk Hogan driving a truck in to a ambulance that had the Rock in it.

The Worst Thing To Ever Happen To Wrestling:
It was no surprise that Bruno mentioned Vince Jr. immediately. Bruno went in to depth about being against steroids, raunchy television content, etc. Bruno is entitled to his opinion. Harley Race just agreed with Bruno's opinion.

Harley Race loosened up towards the last twenty minutes of the DVD. He talked about how important it was to know what moves were used in the undercard, since you don't want your match to look similar to a previous match. Race mentioned how he had the hard task of having to be creative in his matches, since he usually went 60 minutes. Race than went in to his philosophy how screw jobs enable a promoter to bring back rematches and progress storylines, rather than constantly coming up with a new line up for return shows.

Bruno went in depth about all of his opinions and came across as very knowledgeable. Granted some his opinions I would dispute, but that's more due to a generation gap. Bruno still emphasizes the basics in wrestling that drew $$$$. I would highly recommend this DVD to old school and new school DVD collectors. I came out of this DVD by having more respect for Bruno on his beliefs on what draws in wrestling and ring psychology.

Harley Race was more low key and didn't explain his choices as thorough as Bruno. I found his input to be disappointing at times. Luckily Bruno made up for this.

I think this was one of the best DVD's that www.kayfabecommentaries.com ever put out. I wouldn't really call this DVD a debate. I think it came across more as a discussion. Regardless, it was very insightful.

Tags: Missy Hyatt, NWA, Ric Flair, Fabulous Freebirds, Bruiser Brody, Jack Brisco, Verne Gagne, Bill Watts